sigpig
On The Field
Posts: 1,496
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Post by sigpig on Aug 26, 2022 21:21:49 GMT -5
Dane's worst game.
Whites are useless.
Defence can't pick-up the Offence after an INT.
Are we actually WORSE than Ottawa and Edmonton? I would say yes...
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Post by countfloyd1 on Aug 26, 2022 21:36:17 GMT -5
Offence looks disjointed. I noticed 2 receivers in the same area on 3 of the picks. Receivers just aren't good enough.
D didn't get enough consistent pressure on MBT. The disturbing trend to allow 2nd & long conversions continues.
Steinauer's poor coaching & personnel decisions were masked in 2019 by an effective offence, now his faults are being exposed. He's got to go, but I don't expect this to happen.
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sigpig
On The Field
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Post by sigpig on Aug 26, 2022 21:37:42 GMT -5
I count about a dozen personal attacks from the agenda people. No wonder coache left the other site. |
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sigpig
On The Field
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Post by sigpig on Aug 26, 2022 21:39:02 GMT -5
I think Luke Tasker was starting to bawl on the post-game broadcast.
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Post by countfloyd1 on Aug 27, 2022 5:37:02 GMT -5
I count about a dozen personal attacks from the agenda people. No wonder coache left the other site. I just went over there, it's brutal. Dane had a bad game, but without knowing what was called & whether the receivers ran the proper routes or not, it's probably unfair to lay all the blame on him. Our receiving corps wouldn't scare a CIS D. Dunbar & Tim White are the best of a bad bunch & seem to disappear entirely for long stretches. The only ones who always seem to put in an effort are a rookie, Kiondre Smith, & Ungerer, who I think only played specials last night. Also, Mike Jones (can't believe I just typed that) for the partial game he played. Steinauer has to go. All of this stops at his desk, he's the one fully in charge of football ops. For whatever reason, he's unwilling to correct the glaring problems with this team. Bizarre personnel decisions (Papi White does not belong on the field as a returner in this league; Ungerer has shown far more situational understanding of ST & care of the ball), giving Durant a roster spot, failing to play Darby over Liability Leonard, etc. This team has no identity, other than one who fails to make halftime adjustments and collapses every 2nd half. THAT is on the coaching staff, no one else because it's not just 1 or 2 games, it's every game. Hamilton has become the place where most QBs come to ruin their career: Calvillo, Maas, Printers, Glenn, Burris, Collaros, Masoli, Evans. Some, like Calvillo, Burris, and Collaros are able to go elsewhere & resurrect their career, even Damon Allen if you want to go back to the 90s...but it's pretty clear this team hasn't known how to coach QBs since McManus was here, and likely even before that. Austin was probably the best at it since Lancaster, but he lost control for whatever reason. The solution now is to bring in a competent GM, and it aint' Ed Hervey, Allemang or whoever the other GM is. It has to be someone like Huff, and the only available person like that I can think of is Buono, who is retired. This season is a write-off. The only question remaining is whether they have the courage to make the tough decisions, and I don't even know who would do it. Scott Mitchell? Steinauer, Condell & Gibson should go. I'd retain Washington, but under stricter control over use of the prevent D & playcalling later in games, and Butler as well. If Ottawa keeps losing the way they have been, I'd take a run at Lapo after he gets turfed, but only as OC. As for who replaces Steinauer? Not many candidates out there, but Khari is in house & players seem to like playing for the dude, so possibly not that big of a transition. One last thought: I don't advocate this, because I really believe Dane Evans is our QB of the future, but if Calgary is done with BLM & going to go with Maier for the rest of the way, a trade (Evans for BLM straight up) might help both of those QBs, giving them a fresh start in different places. BLM gets to start over in a new place, Dane gets to push Maier in case he falters. Could be win/win, but not sure Dickenson is ready to jettison BLM, & again, I think that if O line gets their shit together already & we get some decent receivers, we can at least compete with Evans as QB. |
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Crash
On The Field
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Post by Crash on Aug 27, 2022 9:04:20 GMT -5
Some morning coffee thoughts from me, like the Count i don't think it going through the game itself last night makes much sense. We've beat to death the same things over and over.
I've been a supporter of Tommy Condell because I'm a believer in continuity and that "he didn't forget how to coach" but it's time that Stein sends a message about accountability within this organization. He has to go. Whether its 100% his fault or not a message needs to be sent that the results are not there, period. This is how you go down a path of losing the locker room - and a message needs to be sent. You have someone in house that can call plays and make some tweaks, it's time to do it.
As for Stein himself i'm not a fan of in season head coaching changes, and while i've been hard on him for many things (His handling of the QB situation, his in game choices, his personnel decisions in the offseason) i've never actually said I think he should be fired, now. and i'm not a fan of just firing him now because. It's my hope that they will see the frustration from the fans, it will start affecting ticket and merchandise sales and then finally decide next offseason to go out and go all in with free agency. Firing Stein sends us down a Edmonton style rebuild and the timing couldnt be worse.
As for Dane, I feel gutted for him. Maybe in this age of social media we can fall victim of seeing their lives. Seeing Dane being excited to return to Hamilton, getting married and birth of his child just makes likeable players that much more likable. Everything we saw in 2019 and 2021 points to him being a franchise QB, upper tier of the league. Last night had to be rock bottom for him (and coache). When it goes bad, it all goes bad. When you see a QB struggle in Hamilton like that you have 1 of 2 thoughts... "I hope we dont give up on him like Calvillo, Collaros, etc." or "He's just another Kevin Eakin, Timmy Chang, Casey Printers" - I'm firmly in the first camp. We know what he can do, we've seen it over an extended period of time. He still hasn't started the equivalent of a full season in this league. I have no idea how much resources the team has put in to Dane (Is Khari working with him, etc) but Tommy Condell is not a QB Coach. If I was Stein I would be ensuring he has the right resources to snap out of this and get back to the QB we know.
Back to Stein - too much, too fast. He should have never been named President of Football Ops. He has zero experience. This organization overcompensates to try and create stability and it's clear the Washington rumors were real. It's why he was likely given a nice raise with the promotion. I don't think he's going anywhere. That means there's no checks and balances for him. How anyone can defend him at this point is beyond me. It's 100% on him - there's nobody else. If you're upset about the Masoli/Evans decision, if you're upset about Washington or Condell, If you're upset about Acklin, Banks, Davis. If you're upset about halftime adjustments, turnovers, etc. Literally everything on the field goes back to him. How anyone can say he's not the problem is asinine.
Quick comment on the Masoli/Evans decision since many are bringing it up again - We saw both QBs with the same team, same playbook, etc. It was obvious who the better QB is. Masoli was winless before getting hurt. Dane struggling doesnt bring that decision into question - just like Burris winning a sub .500 Grey Cup doesnt mean signing Collaros was wrong.
As for the fans, it's sad seeing the people that tried to believe this would be a competitive team now turn on them. They're angry like this is some sort of surprise. Fortunately a few of us had views that this was coming so personally it's not that hard to take. Disappointed? Absolutely.. you always hope you're wrong, but this was clearly some sort of mini rebuild, but now it's turned into something more.
as for coache and his comment in the game thread - first off I concur and invite you to post more, your insight is always welcome and well received. As for the other site, it's unfortunate that a few grumpy old men are given free reign to determine what does and doesn't get talked about. It's too bad that they pounce on a few people that have negative views about the team and now they flip flop to the same position like nothing happened. The irony of the situation is that my "time out" for speaking ill about the team (it's the only explanation I could come up with as I wasnt given one) ended a long time ago. I've also made the choice to leave like many others, mostly because of the old man's club. In many ways the CFL site is a microcosm of the league, bunch of old boomer fans that when they go away will leave nothing left. They don't fit in on traditional social media so they claim a message board with their flag and nobody dares challenge the way they want to interact. Moderators that believe they're above the courtesy of a response and admit they don't have time to actually moderate make it a joke. Defeating the very purpose of why you're there - to interact and debate.
As of right now I may take Labour Day off to spend with my family. My daughter has her first day of school the next day and spending time with her would be more rewarding than watching this team live.
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Post by onemoredork on Aug 27, 2022 9:56:35 GMT -5
Won't try to add anything. Its all been said and well said...but
I was skeptical, bordering on pessimistic to start the year but if you told me Argos and MBT would (to varrying degrees) would solve this defense 3 out of 4 times I would have laughed.
So, in a way, I was a sunny optimist. Why don't I feel better ?
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Crash
On The Field
Posts: 1,513
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Post by Crash on Aug 27, 2022 9:58:53 GMT -5
Was thinking the same after I posted.
This team was built specifically to have a shut down D. One as good as Winnipeg. It's not even close. Might not even be top half of the league.
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Post by countfloyd1 on Aug 27, 2022 10:14:58 GMT -5
On the D: I actually believe the personnel is there for the most part when we're not injured. It comes down to in-game coaching.
Dane is the right QB to keep, we've all seen him perform when he's got quality talent around him. Plus, the dude cares. A lot. That's evident. His strip from last year's East Final still ranks as the greatest play I've seen from a Ticat QB.
Btw, Crash....I'm pretty f*cking old. Born Dec 1964, but I can't take that forum.
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sigpig
On The Field
Posts: 1,496
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Post by sigpig on Aug 27, 2022 10:15:02 GMT -5
Was thinking the same after I posted. This team was built specifically to have a shut down D. One as good as Winnipeg. It's not even close. Might not even be top half of the league. Dylan Wynn is our best D-lineman, and he's injured. Micah Johnson had ONE good game this year. Teddy was a game-time scratch (injuries and performance?). We lost both starting DEs to free agency and haven't replaced them with capable players. We have a hole in the secondary that constantly is picked-upon, yet Washington/Orlondo won't replace him with Darby. Linebackers are great, but not if they have to cover the fast SBs in man coverage.
Yup - this is a top-tier Defence - NOT!
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Post by onemoredork on Aug 27, 2022 10:16:03 GMT -5
The same people who want to bail on Evans are the same people who thought it was perfectly reasonable to invest 7 seasons in Masoli with next to zero progression.
Is this irony ? Feels like irony.
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Crash
On The Field
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Post by Crash on Aug 27, 2022 10:19:11 GMT -5
The same people who want to bail on Evans are the same people who thought it was perfectly reasonable to invest 7 seasons in Masoli with next to zero progression. Is this irony ? Feels like irony. no, it's trying to say "I told you so" without actually saying it because that would mean you're taking a side. Most of them won't take a side. They just take it somewhere down the middle. |
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Post by countfloyd1 on Aug 27, 2022 10:19:33 GMT -5
The same people who want to bail on Evans are the same people who thought it was perfectly reasonable to invest 7 seasons in Masoli with next to zero progression. Is this irony ? Feels like irony. Pessimist!! Stone the blasphemer!!! |
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Post by mightypope on Aug 27, 2022 10:44:26 GMT -5
Don't really have much to add as it's already been said (great morning coffee thoughts Crash!!!). Now, after last night's disaster I firmly believe we will not make the playoffs this year(western crossover will be happening). The team is just not good enough talent wise and coaching wise. To miss the playoffs might actually be the best thing to happen because the organization WILL have to make some major changes. Stein ain't going anywhere and will get one more season to right the ship then it's anybody's guess as to what happens after that. Feel really bad for Evans because I know he is better than this. This looks exactly like the same situation we saw with a shell-shocked Calvillo in the 1997 season when he had absolutely nothing to work with along with terrible play calling. Four more home games left and I'm not looking forward to attending any one of them, including Labour Day.
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sigpig
On The Field
Posts: 1,496
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Post by sigpig on Aug 27, 2022 11:36:47 GMT -5
People are only now starting to realize that the off-season decisions have crippled this team.
Is Ja'Gared worth $250k? Right now, I would say not. Dodged the bullet on that one.
Is Speedy worth around $100k? Right now, I say maybe. He would be our #2 receiver behind Dunbar and has a LOT of experience.
Mauldin IV is certainly worth whatever Ottawa's paying him, if not more.
Are Micah and Laurent worth whatever they're making? Not sure (can't remember the contract details), but the team sure isn't getting much production out of them on a consistent basis.
Is anyone on the O-Line (save Revenberg) worth their paycheque? Definitely not. While it's getting better, it has almost reached "acceptable" levels after 11 games.
Aside from Kiondre Smith and Mike Jones, nobody in the receiving corps consistently works hard enough to get open or fight for balls. There are flashes (Durant on his TD, Timmeh last game, Dunbar every other game) but they are NOT guys you can count upon game-in and game-out.
Don't get me started on the kicking/punting game - that's been covered ad nauseum.
I honestly don't think that the majority of our Offensive players could start on any other team. Revenberg, Dane, MAYBE ST-E and Jackson, but no receivers and no other O-linemen. This is ALL a result of extremely poor decisions with regards to the wrong players kept and the wrong players being let go (Acklin).
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